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Fabrício Nobre: ​​“The cannabis market has a different taste, my eyes shine”

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With an easy smile and contagious humor, Fabrício Conrado Nobre is perhaps one of the funniest faces in the world of cannabis in Portugal. He was born and raised in Brazil, but ended up marrying a Portuguese woman, which made him settle in Portugal for over 20 years.

With a career dedicated to technologies, Fabrício is the face behind widepartner, a company of the InCentea group that works with Sage management software, one of the most renowned internationally. In cannabis, she found her latest business, adapting what she was already doing in other industries to an innovative, rapidly growing sector.

We met with Fabrício Nobre in his Lisbon office for an enlightening conversation about the role of technology and management software at the service of the cannabis industry.

How did Fabrício, being Brazilian, end up living here, in Portugal?
This year I've been here for 21 years and what I always say is: what brought me to Portugal was my heart. I was doing a backpacking personal and professional life in England, after finishing my college in Brazil, and stayed in a hostel, where I met a Portuguese woman who spoke similarly to me. This Portuguese woman is now the mother of my three daughters, so I say that what brought me to Portugal was her heart. I had already set up a company that sold software in Brazil – which is what I still do today – but at the time, after 47 days, I dropped everything and came to Portugal, with “one hand in front and the other behind”. I was 24 years old, still a 'kid', and I knocked on the door of Sage, the leading software manufacturer (and still is) in Europe. That's how I started my journey in Portugal.

So you didn't come back to Brazil anymore?
After two years we went to Brazil and spent about two years there, but we returned to Portugal because my mother-in-law got sick. However, I went to a French multinational, where they did the same thing, but with the 2008 crisis the company closed. I was the last person to leave the company and I had two alternatives: either I would go into unemployment and earn the subsidy for two years or I would submit a project to create my own job. That's what I did.

“Symbolisms exist and the green leaf has always been linked to my trajectory.”

And then you received the entire subsidy right away, right?
Right, I received the entirety to invest in creating my own job. I bought a commercial car and a laptop again, I went to the secretary at home to talk to all the customers at the time: “look, the company where I worked no longer exists…”. I'd just been a dad for months, and that's it, I had to get back to the entrepreneurial side of it.

Is that where you founded widepartner?
No, then I founded GreenLeaf, which had a little green leaf as its logo. The name Sage in Portuguese means “sage”, which has a green leaf, and then I think it all matches. The symbolisms exist and the green leaf has always been linked to my trajectory. I created my company alone, but this company grew and, after twelve years of growth, I had taken the software to Brazil. I created the company in Brazil, I had teams there and in Portugal, and the company was already too big for me, as a manager and sole partner. In addition, I was becoming a father, a daughter was born every three years, and when my youngest daughter was three years old, I don't know why, he clicked on me and I thought: “Look, Fabrício, life is not just work, it's not it's just having the Porsche in the garage, it's not just traveling a lot – I would go to Brazil eight times a year, not counting other countries – I think you have to find a way to take advantage of everything you've built and improve the situation”. So, my option was to give a new meaning to my operation in Brazil, because I didn't want to travel a lot, I wanted to stay in Portugal. And what happened was that a competitor of mine, the InCentea group, which has been in the market for 35 years, had the intention of expanding into the Brazilian market and we started talking. We reached an understanding and created the concept to reinforce the widepartner brand, which is a merger of a group of companies that already existed in the market. At the time, while GreenLeaf, my company had 20 to 30 employees in Brazil and a reasonable turnover, but today we are part of a group of 360 people, with a turnover of around 20 million, we are in nine countries and it is a different ecosystem. Widepartner, within the InCentea group, is the owner of the partnership with Sage, which is the manufacturer of the software with which I have been working for over twenty years.

For those who don't know, can you explain better what Sage does?
Sage is an English company, listed on the London Stock Exchange (LON: SGE), and provides the market with management software to control and manage the entire area of ​​accounting, logistics, production, the financial area, human resources, etc. ., for any type or business segment.

“I am Brazilian here and in Brazil I am Portuguese. So, I’m already a countryless guy.”

And what is the role of the widepartner?
widepartner is Sage's partner that sells, implements the software and provides support or technical support. As a group, we are in nine countries, but widepartner has offices in Portugal, Spain, France and Brazil. Our role is to help companies, whether in the traditional sectors of industry, distribution, services or agriculture, to manage their business through software.

And how did it get to the cannabis market?
Cannabis appeared when one of the pioneers and main players from the international market came to Portugal, immediately following the change in legislation that allowed medical cannabis. This company chose to use Sage software and as I am curious, I went to investigate and saw an opportunity in this sector. I've always been a bit of a straight face, and I still am, I only started drinking alcoholic beverages when I came to live in Portugal, I spent my youth practically without going to parties. But a funny thing is that, as an adult, my friends thought I was on drugs, because I was very irreverent and the fastest, the first to enter the dance floor and the last to leave. As I was never seen with a bottle of alcohol in my hand, I didn't even drink a beer, so it could only be drugs, but the truth is, I've never tried it. When I came to Portugal, my sister-in-law used to say “Fabrício, give it time to understand what wine is…” So, today I am a more socially alcoholic person than I used to be! (laughs)

Doesn't mean you have to drink alcohol to be cool, it is not?
No, obviously not, but today I can get some pleasure from drinking a good wine and having a beer when I feel like it, when it's hot.

Maybe he fell into the cauldron when he was little, like Obelix, from Asterix, and during his life he never needed the potion… (laughs)
I was born with it! (laughs) A funny thing: my father is a manufacturer of alcoholic beverages in Brazil and has an industry that supplies 60 thousand points of sale.

Sometimes this has the opposite effect. For example, children of parents who smoke sometimes have an aversion to tobacco.
Well, maybe my father smoked, but I never saw him smoke. My mother never smoked and neither did I.

“I started going to all these conferences to learn more about cannabinoids and the endocannabinoid system.”

 

 With the good disposition that characterizes him, Fabrício learned about medical cannabis by going to all the congresses and conferences he could. Here, at PTMC22, in Lisbon. Photo: Renato Velasco | PTMC

But how did you even start researching cannabis?
I added curiosity to the professional aspect and what was most interesting was the journey, which is also one of the reasons why I get to know your work through Cannareporter. My first contact with the cannabis world was at the PTMC conference – Portugal Medical Cannabis – where I went to see and hear doctors and researchers talking about cannabis. I was very surprised by a doctor who spoke while lying in bed, remember?

 

Of course, Dr. Franjo Grotenhermen.
Exactly! You have a bedridden person who is a lecturer… Something there woke me up. See doctors, neuropediatricians, who have been taking care of autistic children for 20-30 years saying: “Look, I have been taking care of these children for 20-30 years and in the last 2-3 years I have been treating with this type of medication and the results are different…” This all really moved me. From several things that I followed at the conference, I saw that there is a very wide spectrum of opportunities to improve the quality of people's lives, which were not only related to symptoms of anxiety, depression, but which are alternatives to analgesics, to stabilize crises from epilepsy, to autism… and then I started going to all these conferences, to learn more about cannabinoids and the endocannabinoid system.

Was it a big revelation for you?
It was a huge paradigm shift. Hearing the testimony of a mother, who wonders how and where she is going to get cannabis to improve her child's quality of life, a product that is stigmatized as a drug… how can this be? Nowadays I already receive contacts from people, because they see that I talk a lot about the topic at a professional level, I share knowledge and support institutions that help people to know more about cannabis. Obviously it has to do with my professional side of being able to help companies establish themselves in the market, comply with a set of highly complex rules, which I like, but I also try to help transform this prejudice of mine into a supporter of a revolution for a better society.

What is your biggest challenge right now?
The path I have been trying to take is not only to make Portugal a hub of cannabis production abroad, but also to make Portugal able to drink from this new revolution, giving those who live in Portugal access to this type of medicine, products, alternative for health.

“The specific cannabis market has a different taste. My eyes shine, it moves me more, it has a greater purpose than just the professional or financial of things.”

Was cannabis not just another area of ​​business for you, how would anything else be? Or does this delivery also happen in other areas?
I confess that I am always an enthusiast. I'll explain to you how I chose my course: I have a degree in production engineering, here in Portugal I call myself an industrial engineer. This engineer has the ability to help any type of industry, be it a hospital, where a sick person enters and a healthy person leaves, or the largest egg producers, which are our customers here, where a hen enters and eggs come out, or screws and metals and a bicycle comes out. This is something that has always awakened me a lot. Using software to help these industries, wherever it may be, is what I chose for the professional path of my life. However, the cannabis-specific market has a different taste. My eyes shine, it moves me more, it has a greater purpose than just the professional or financial of things. We already had pharmaceutical clients in Portugal, traditional pharmaceutical companies, which are compliant and bring health, but I feel the challenge and purpose of cannabis is different. It's a different thing...

It also has a certain innovation factor, doesn't it?
Exactly, because it is also a challenge, because we use our best agricultural practices. We have customers in the wine sector in Portugal, who produce the best wines, as we have other food industries, like kiwi plantations and other things. And we have pharmaceuticals, highly laboratory, controlled things, but now how are we going to make a laboratory or a control within agriculture, within a plant that we already know that there are thousands of species, that each one has hundreds of active principles… we are in CBD or THC and there is still so much to discover... We have to have systems that allow us to carry out all this control, but also to generate research and information that gives credibility to the products, so technology is a very important part for this market manage to grow.

And how was the process of starting to work in an area so different from those you were used to?
We had to break a lot of stone from the first projects. There was a lack of knowledge about the legislation and the authorities that make it, but today, fortunately, the result of the work they have done and the information, to raise awareness of society, doctors... And then there are the suppliers, whether of machines, or of greenhouses, even even pest control. At the last PTMC I met a pest control specialist who works with pets, who was called to go to a cannabis plantation, and when he got there he said: “I'm used to tomatoes, blueberries, and I don't know what else... now those plants… let's see what the animal is!” It's all part of a journey and I find it funny to be a part of this one. dream team, to participate in this discovery is very good.

“When the first cannabis companies applied for a license in Portugal, there was no integrated management software to respond to the compliance from Infarmed.”

Is it stimulating?
Yeah… And then it's fun, because we're doing commercial work, but it's been almost five years and I'm very happy to work with the first players who settled here and who are succeeding, who are already producing and exporting, and who I've been following since they didn't even have the land yet! And that's it, I feel like I'm part of this journey.

And this family?
Yes, from this family!

How many clients do you have in Portugal and how many are specifically in the cannabis field?
As a group we have two thousand customers spread all over the world. Within the universe of widepartner, Sage, we have about 300. Within those 300, I think we don't reach 4% of customers in the cannabis industry, but 80% of our business is around 70 customers. In other words, we are currently reaching around 10% of customers in a given market segment, and cannabis customers already have a certain weight. We have almost a dozen customers dedicated only to cannabis, with companies already certified, which is already a considerable number. Another interesting thing that differentiates this sector from any other is that, this year, there was a change in the legislation which included the word 'electronically'. When the first cannabis companies applied for a license in Portugal, there was no integrated management software to respond to the compliance from Infarmed. Many solved the problem manually, because they still did not have solutions on the market that would respond to the compliance cannabis and your needs. The 'electronic' of the new legislation goes against everything that has to do with traceability, quality controls, access controls, everything must be done electronically.

That played in your favor! 
That's it… (laughs) I can't say that it's a boring thing for the market, because it will require greater rigor, but for me, of course, it was good. What has happened is that those companies that already have an Infarmed license are converting to 'electronically'. But what is interesting is that there are companies that were born electronically compliance, with our software, which is a bit of a different term. I have companies that are in the process of implementation, I have others that are in the process of negotiation, but I cannot say which ones they are. But there are many others that are on the way to get here too, so that's not bad. (laughs)

We interviewed Fabrício Nobre at widepartner's Lisbon office and offered him a Cannareporter mug. Photo: Laura Ramos

If you have to think about your goals for the future, what are they?
My objectives in the field of cannabis is to be able to place the flag of Portugal as the hub at European level. This is a first objective, because to dethrone the North American, Canadian and European market as producers is difficult, but I think that the medicinal product has conditions, because in the American and Canadian market the legislation is different. The distinction between pharmaceutical and non-pharmaceutical, as they have it, is very much in the recreational market. In other words, they have many producers, but we have clients who came here from the United States to work with us, because we are much more demanding. So, my first objective is, really, to be able to help this entire ecosystem, raise the flag of Portugal and grow more and more at the European level. Then try to share that know-how with other regions we are already in. When the Spanish market is more mature for cannabis, when the French market is more open, when the Brazilian market is stronger in terms of legislation, it is also trying to help companies in these markets, facilitating the growth of these customers on this journey. .

And do you also foresee potential customers with the legalization of adult use?
When you know that there are more than 80 pre-licenses granted by Infarmed to plant cannabis, you start to think: “For whom are all these companies going to produce? Where is all this going?” Today I still see with some uncertainty how the path will go, but I have a gut feeling. that everything will be closely linked to the more pharmaceutical distribution channel, even if it is for recreational use. This will lead to more companies, but, at the same time, the differential that the company will have in the market is whether it will follow a strictly pharmaceutical path or not. Because there is that limbo, isn't it, if it's CBD, if it's oil, if it's a supplement, if it's medicine, if it's medicinal or recreational, if I'll be able to have a little plant in my house... so there's still this uncertainty, but I believe that the controlled way is going to be very much by the medical way. In any case, companies have to have this very great systemic control to respond to imposed demands, but, at the same time, they become much more efficient, therefore, more profitable. I think the future is prosperous.

And goals on a personal level, now that you already have the Porsche in your garage… 
No, but that... (laughs) It's already more than parked, that doesn't matter much... My main focus today, and for having changed my path a little bit to be like this, closer to a group and another structure , it was to be able to have more moments of pause, real moments of pause. For the first time in 14 years, I took a three-week vacation last year. Three weeks of vacation where I actually shut down and didn't look at the computer.

“I really like my job, but my purpose has to do with having more time for my family and also giving back a little bit of what I received to society.”

Did you really manage to do that?
I achieved! But that doesn't mean that over the years I didn't go home, my daughters didn't see me, or that I worked too much. I really like my work, but my purpose has to do with having more time for my family and also giving back a little of what I received to society. And I think taking up this cannabis theme is my way of trying to help raise the flag, because even my dad said to me, half in jest: “Fabrício, man, you after so many years… you never drank and now will you stay in this world of drugs?”, which refers to a pejorative way of things. I think it's a little bit like that, because I don't have ambitions of… of…

 … of owning the Lamborghini, right? (laughs)
No, but by chance the desktop with on my computer is a photo of a Lamborghini! (laughs) I would like to have a Lamborghini, just because, but an old one, an old one, just like my little Porsche, old too… In 45 years I learned something from my wife, that the sun illuminates us in our lives . The sun rises here and sets back here. And if we are facing the sun, the sun is illuminating us, it is making us grow, it is giving us energy and showing us a way. When the path is lit, the sun gets up here and it's about to set, isn't it? So it's time to start giving back that light... It seems like something a little fancied, but that's what I feel, that I'm increasingly concerned with this other journey, which is to be able to help my daughters' growth process, to be more close to their path and try to show them the values ​​they should take into account, in addition to personal and professional issues. And if, up ahead, I see Portugal in hub from the cannabis world and if you are my clients and recognize my work, then I will feel that my mission has been accomplished. And when you learn that an autistic child, or a child with epilepsy, or a person who had an accident, managed to go to the pharmacy and get cannabis, or a person who thought cannabis was just a drug that served to erase the mind, changed idea… then, I'll think I did something. (laughs) I think it's a bit around.

And Portugal, is it still in your heart?
Yes, yes, yes… Portugal will always be… we never know what the future brings us, do we? In other words, my parents and my family are in Brazil, but this was my choice and I have a lot to thank Portugal and the Portuguese people for. When I came here I didn't have any friends and I managed to establish good friendships here, people have always treated me very well, personally and professionally, so I just have to say thank you and return it.

So, after all this, is Fabrício now a Portuguese with a Brazilian accent?
Yes, but I am stateless, because when I go to Brazil with my wife and three daughters, we go to stores and they think I'm a tourist, they ask me if I'm enjoying Rio de Janeiro (laughs)... Portuguese terminology and I have to remember to turn off the chip and speak Brazilian. And the same here. That is, I am Brazilian here and in Brazil I am Portuguese. So, I'm already a countryless guy.

 

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[Disclaimer: Please note that this text was originally written in Portuguese and is translated into English and other languages ​​using an automatic translator. Some words may differ from the original and typos or errors may occur in other languages.]
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